27 replies to this topic

[weirdmusic]

Could somebody explain to me, why it is that there is such a huge gap between trains & the platform edge. So much so that the rail companies have to have a public announcement to tell us punters to "Mind The Gap".

Trains are designed & built to a specification, platforms likewise, the rails also. So why on earth can't they all be built to match up?

I can understand if there was a small gap, but the trains & the platforms are separated not just in distance apart but also height. Consequently small children can literally disappear between the train & the platform edge if they miss their footing. Anybody using a pushchair needs help to board or alight. God help you if your unfortunate enough to have a wheelchair - the train companies need to have ramps readily available. What a crazy situation.

Does anybody know why this has come about? If you travel on the continent by train, they seem to have worked out a means of closing the gap, why can't the UK?

[spyglass]

weirdmusic, on 01 August 2010 - 11:22 AM, said:

Could somebody explain to me, why it is that there is such a huge gap between trains & the platform edge. So much so that the rail companies have to have a public announcement to tell us punters to "Mind The Gap".

Trains are designed & built to a specification, platforms likewise, the rails also. So why on earth can't they all be built to match up?

I can understand if there was a small gap, but the trains & the platforms are separated not just in distance apart but also height. Consequently small children can literally disappear between the train & the platform edge if they miss their footing. Anybody using a pushchair needs help to board or alight. God help you if your unfortunate enough to have a wheelchair - the train companies need to have ramps readily available. What a crazy situation.

Does anybody know why this has come about? If you travel on the continent by train, they seem to have worked out a means of closing the gap, why can't the UK?

Because we have a crap antequated system which is run on a make do and mend approach. At Burley for instance, instead of building new platforms to better suit the new trains, they just piled more height on the existing ones - you can still see the old platforms below. On the continent I expect they would have demolished and started again.

[weirdmusic]

spyglass, on 01 August 2010 - 11:44 AM, said:

Because we have a crap antequated system which is run on a make do and mend approach. At Burley for instance, instead of building new platforms to better suit the new trains, they just piled more height on the existing ones - you can still see the old platforms below. On the continent I expect they would have demolished and started again.

They built new platforms at Leeds Station, relaid the rails, spent millions, but still they don't match up!

[Grumpy]

In very simple terms trains are built to a given width, to fit within the loading guage-so they dont hit things like bridges. Stations are built where the tracks are, and the tracks may be on curves, with different radii at different stations, so what might be an exact fit for one station may not do at a neighbour. It's all a compromise unless you can build a totally new line with all platforms on straight track. Similarly train height can vary (within the limits of the loading guage)depending on the load-a carriage with 100+commuters in it will sit lower on its suspension than a similar carriage with only a few passengers.
On the whole I dont think our local line is bad in this respect, and certainly as good as most foreign railways.

[Wharfedale]

This is the stupidest thread ever! If the train is an extra inch from the platform them extend your stride!

[Sebastian-Smythe]

Wharfedale, on 04 August 2010 - 08:16 PM, said:

This is the stupidest thread ever! If the train is an extra inch from the platform them extend your stride!

There's nowt stupid about it!

Not everyone is as supple in the joints.

There was a time when Burley had porters and portable steps for those less able to board.

One day all will find it difficult to lift a leg.

[catbazza]

Sebastian-Smythe, on 05 August 2010 - 10:31 AM, said:

There's nowt stupid about it!

Not everyone is as supple in the joints.

There was a time when Burley had porters and portable steps for those less able to board.

One day all will find it difficult to lift a leg.

I concur your statement Seb, to quote one of todays rags "Quarter of population will be over 65 by 2031", so thank you for thinking about the aging section of the public.

I can remember the little wooden steps which the porters always seemed to have to hand & also the helping hand offered by them or by the guard to climb up into the train, most sadly those days of help & courtesy have long gone, now I no longer travel by train because of a disability I cannot manage the climb up into the carriage whereas in the old days there would have been the ever helping hand.

[Wharfedale]

No, I am right, it's a stupid post.

[Wharfedale]

I was talking to the conductor/gaurd on the train this evening and he told me that they have moved the platform back, away from the tracks four times this year in order to widen the gap. He said that once the gap was sufficiently wide, no one would be able to use the trains so they would be able to close the station and thus demonstrate a cost saving.

He went on to tell me that they then plan to re-open the station in 2015 at which time they will be able to show an expansion to the service and additional income.

During the period between closure and reopening, the plan is to use the station as a drugs den, graffiti park and general outside toilet.

It seems like a well thought out idea which is no doubt backed up by a robust business case.

[appropriatebridge]

Wharfedale, on 04 August 2010 - 08:16 PM, said:

This is the stupidest thread ever! If the train is an extra inch from the platform them extend your stride!

Surely we want as many people as possible to participate in the discussion forum. Describing any threads as "stupid" is hardly likely to encourage this. There are many topics here which might not be of dynamic interest to everyone but if they are of interest to the poster I think we should all respecct that point of view and not decry it. If the issue is not of ongoing interest it will die a natural death anyway. I am constantly disappointed by the few number of new contributors to the Forum and wharfedale's comments (especially as an administrator) are appalling.

If the World respected the individual and their views, it would be a better place. Such comments are likely to persuade everyone to "do a nabbers".

[Sebastian-Smythe]

Wharfedale, on 05 August 2010 - 04:01 PM, said:

No, I am right, it's a stupid post.

I stick with my original post.

I will also be contacting they who run the trains on the Wharfedale line
to see what the truth is about this.

If as you state it is true then I will take it further. Also I shall seek
a reply as to why a guard said it in the first.

[blunt pencil]

Amazing. The gap is about 12" - but as the track actually curves as it exits the station, that gap may increase a bit.

I am concerned that people cannot cope with striding the gap. I bet the walk up the hill to the station must take ages for them.

If you are really concerned, you could ask the guard to get the ramps out of the train for you.


By the way - they announce the warning over the tannoy so as to give a verbal warning, just like at leeds they announce "due to todays inclement weather take extra care when dismounting the train".

Get a life

[weirdmusic]

blunt pencil, on 07 August 2010 - 10:10 PM, said:

...................... I am concerned that people cannot cope with striding the gap. I bet the walk up the hill to the station must take ages for them.
................... Get a life

Clearly your not a wheel chair user or have ever had to push a pram, your not blind nor partially sighted. Life's rosy for you.

What makes the issue more problematic for people less able than you, is not the distance apart, but the difference in height. As "Grumpy" pointed out in an earlier post, there has to be a gap between the trains & the platform edge, so every type of train can pass along & through all stations, bridges etc.

The distance apart can't be changed, but the height difference at platforms can be. Either raise the edge of the platform or drop the level of the rails.

[Wharfedale]

weirdmusic, on 08 August 2010 - 09:08 AM, said:

The distance apart can't be changed, but the height difference at platforms can be. Either raise the edge of the platform or drop the level of the rails.

That won't happen though. The cost of the loss of business by those who can't easily board the train would be a great deal less than the cost of modification.

However, I, for one would like to see an expansion of the line to connect to Otley. I understand that there was once a station in Otley.

[marygill]

However, I, for one would like to see an expansion of the line to connect to Otley. I understand that there was once a station in Otley.
[/quote]

Yes there was indeed a very well used line at Otley, and as children one of our favourite pastimes was to stand on the bridge over the line as the steam trains came under.
We used to go all over on trips out and then of course the Beeching cuts were brought in and that was the end of that.
A great pity I feel and it has proved to be very short sighted.
It is highly unlikely that the line will ever be connected to Otley again as all the bridges over the roads have been knocked down

[Flas# #arry]

...and houses have been build along the route of the old railway line at Otley.

[eileenb61]

Wharfedale, on 05 August 2010 - 05:20 PM, said:

I was talking to the conductor/gaurd on the train this evening and he told me that they have moved the platform back, away from the tracks four times this year in order to widen the gap. He said that once the gap was sufficiently wide, no one would be able to use the trains so they would be able to close the station and thus demonstrate a cost saving.

He went on to tell me that they then plan to re-open the station in 2015 at which time they will be able to show an expansion to the service and additional income.

During the period between closure and reopening, the plan is to use the station as a drugs den, graffiti park and general outside toilet.

It seems like a well thought out idea which is no doubt backed up by a robust business case.

Wharfedale.
I take it you don't think much to the railway or for the people who may have to use it?.
If they've "moved the platform back four times already this year" how and when was this done?.. by the railway fairies overnight?? because i cannot imagine that the platforms could be moved back while the trains were actually running through the day.
Yes the gaps are a bit of a worry,even i think its a bit large at times ,and im not exactly a shy quaking violet when it comes to facing things.

I know the trains arent brilliant but they are a marginally bit better than the bus for getting to Leeds or definatly to Bradford (but thats a different subject all together)

[Wharfedale]

What makes you think that I don’t think much to the railway or people who use it? I’ll admit that I don’t think about them very often, but every time I do, I just want to give ‘em all a big kiss on the lips!

... but on a serious note, I was staggered to learn that they have been moving the platform back, away from the line and that really is quite something, given that its a solid block of concrete. Hats off to them. The Guard didn’t say how or when it was done, but I assume it was at night.

Oh, and for the record, I think that the trains here are brilliant, and I use them often.

[Sebastian-Smythe]

Wharfedale, on 08 August 2010 - 02:36 PM, said:

The Guard didn’t say how or when it was done, but I assume it was at night.

It's my guess that guard hadn't a clue what they were on about. Major works carried out on rail lines of this nature are mostly precluded with info in local papers. Let's see what WRUG have to say about it shall we. When you get the 'new' line to Otley where will it go from there? A previous poster rightly pointed out houses have been built where the line used to go. Then there's the question of what you will do with Otley bypass, dig another tunnel perhaps? A minimum of three bridges to install, Environment Agency ruling on Green Belts, lack of funding from Westminster. I'll stick with the bus.

Best of luck in your endevours though!

[steve219]

weirdmusic, on 01 August 2010 - 11:22 AM, said:

Could somebody explain to me, why it is that there is such a huge gap between trains & the platform edge. So much so that the rail companies have to have a public announcement to tell us punters to "Mind The Gap".
(snip)

Many platforms were built a very long time ago to suit trains long since departed to the scrapyard. To adjust them to suit now would cost zillions, which would come out of taxes or fares, and we all complain both are too high! The announcement is made to stop any claims for injury as a result of being careless in this nanny state. After all, we have to climb steps to get to bed, onto the bus and up to the Town Hall entrance... There is a ramp on evera train, and a guard to help as well.

S

spyglass, on 01 August 2010 - 11:44 AM, said:

Because we have a crap antequated system which is run on a make do and mend approach. At Burley for instance, instead of building new platforms to better suit the new trains, they just piled more height on the existing ones - you can still see the old platforms below. On the continent I expect they would have demolished and started again.

and you are happy for a new platform to come out of your taxes, and for the line to be closed for weeks while the new platforms are built, I think not!!

catbazza, on 05 August 2010 - 01:07 PM, said:

I concur your statement Seb, to quote one of todays rags "Quarter of population will be over 65 by 2031", so thank you for thinking about the aging section of the public.

I can remember the little wooden steps which the porters always seemed to have to hand & also the helping hand offered by them or by the guard to climb up into the train, most sadly those days of help & courtesy have long gone, now I no longer travel by train because of a disability I cannot manage the climb up into the carriage whereas in the old days there would have been the ever helping hand.

I don;t understand why you might be able to climb the little wooden steps of yore, which were steep, several and rickerty, and you cannot manage the one step needed today, less than one foot, or ask the guard for help, he is on the platform to do just that at each stop and has a ramp to help. there is even a sign on the door to tell you where it is. The railways are vastly more disabled-friendly today then ever before, even if cost does limit 100% access for all.

Wharfedale, on 05 August 2010 - 05:20 PM, said:

I was talking to the conductor/gaurd on the train this evening and he told me that they have moved the platform back, away from the tracks four times this year in order to widen the gap. He said that once the gap was sufficiently wide, no one would be able to use the trains so they would be able to close the station and thus demonstrate a cost saving.

He went on to tell me that they then plan to re-open the station in 2015 at which time they will be able to show an expansion to the service and additional income.

During the period between closure and reopening, the plan is to use the station as a drugs den, graffiti park and general outside toilet.

It seems like a well thought out idea which is no doubt backed up by a robust business case.

As you well realise, this tale is either a jovial invention or the guard was taking the piss. Others on this thread seem to think you are serious.