34 replies to this topic

[Matt]

Hi all,

I am aware that there are some rumours doing the rounds that the Council is proposing to close the library and sell the building to a retailer.

I'd like to state quite categorically that this is NOT correct. Some rumours have simply got out of control, as they often do! this one was understandable - we're all aware of the impact of the financial crisis on public funding, and we do need to keep a close eye on the services we have to make sure they are protected. Ward councillors are doing that very actively.

Officers and Councillors do talk, and I have an absolute commitment that the building will not be sold... and just in case that is every on the table (which it isn't) I've stated very clearly that this should NEVER be an option and this has been accepted as not being up for consideration in any way.

It IS correct that the council is looking at an option proposed by a third party that could result in significant investment in and improvement of the library, as well as making it more sustainable in the long term. Councillors are actively engaged in this discussion but I really can't add to it at the moment as I'm not at liberty to do so - and nor for that matter is the nit who leaked the unhelpful rumour in the first place!

Councillors will not entertain any option that does not provide a clear positive benefit to burley and ensure the long terms sutainability of the library. It's good to have new options to ensure this is the case, and I WILL update the forum, in full, as soon as possible and as I have something to say. In the meantime I can't stop the rumours (who can!)and if more people do go through the libary doors, so much the better for everyone. Perhaps though I can change the rumour by being totally clear:

The rumours doing the rounds and the suggestion made by forum member Dennis that the library may be closed and the building sold is - as I'm sure he'll be delighed to hear - complete and utter rubbish .

Any threat to this critical service will never be entertained; anything that helps make it better always will be.

Matt

[blunt pencil]

I like the idea of a library, but will confess i have never used the service in Burley. I guess because i can access so much online, from the comfort of my own home.

If i am out, I will go to a Waterstone's and enjoy a cup of coffee at the same time.

Maybe part of the problem is that people do not know what the village library includes. Its sad. How do we make the library a service people want to use.

[weirdmusic]

blunt pencil, on 27 November 2010 - 11:45 AM, said:

...................... How do we make the library a service people want to use.

Put the shelving onto castors, so that they can be moved around, to create a more useable community space.
Have a coffee shop?  Any surplus (profit) ploughed back into the facilities - more books; CDroms etc.

[blunt pencil]

I would definitely use it as a coffee shop. Its a community service, so it should start integrating as part of the community. We should have a citizen's advice in there, or use it as a meeting place for the community police officers.

I want to see the library service remain, but to do that, it has to attract people in

[Grumpy]

blunt pencil, on 28 November 2010 - 09:14 PM, said:

I would definitely use it as a coffee shop. Its a community service, so it should start integrating as part of the community. We should have a citizen's advice in there, or use it as a meeting place for the community police officers.

I want to see the library service remain, but to do that, it has to attract people in

Well they could start by buying some books. There dont seem to be many books there and some of the present ones seem to have been there since the place was built. Perhaps Bradford should rotate the books around its libraries more frequently-if you thought all the books were changed every 3 months there might be more incentive to use. Otley and Guiseley put Ilkley and Burley to shame.

I sometimes muse on what the library would be like if someone from Morrisons ran it. There would be much more intensive use of the space-out with the plants taking up space on the floor and in with more shelves for books. Similarly the aisles might be narrowed to make more room for rows of shelving, and taller shelves put in.

The lack of a public toilet doesn't help-must deter mums with youngsters.

If we are to be told there's no money for books then is it too much to expect adults to pay for using the service? Why is providing a free read of a Mills and Boon or Autocar an essential public service?

And what's wrong with selling the building? Perhaps not to a retailer but as a site for housing. It has a value and must cost money to maintain and heat. Can't it be relocated into a room somewhere else eg the Queen's Hall? Where I was brought up the library was based in a school hall. It opened on Saturdays and during the week between 3.30 amd 7pm (ie when schoolchildren and workers might want to use it). The books were kept on shelves in big cupboards which were closed when the hall was otherwise in use.

[spyglass]

Burley library must be kept. A library is an important part of any "nice" place to which people aspire to live. We should be encouraging youngsters to make use of the facility and read books instead of being on the streets. It could do to be modernised and uplifted and if a deal third party can achieve this then Im all for it. The only thing is that the third party should never have the right to dictate what happens to the library otherwise I can see a thin end of the wedge where the library bit gets progressively shrunk and the third party interest takes over.

The choice of books does seem to have diminished over recent years. Are libraries having to buy less because of financial constraints? Maybe part of any deal could be that the third party has to provide some extra funds for library use.

The computers should be maintained (maybe improved)for those that cannot afford their own or dont understand the technology to install at home. It will not be long before any interaction with official bodies has to be done via a computer.

I have cast my iBurley vote to improve Burleys internet. Have you?

[Grumpy]

I wasn't suggesting Burley shouldn't have a library. But my definition of a Library is primarily a service for access to books that will inspire regular use, especially by the young. I think Burley could do better and it needs a bigger book selection.

I dont think we should be emotionally attached to the present building. The book lending service could be located anywhere. However much you might spend on the current building it's too small to be excellent. Perhaps like most of the village pubs.

If we could find room in another public building that could provide a better service at less cost to the ratepayers then we should be looking at that.

I agree re the computers. But isn't something similar available in the Queen's Hall?

[weirdmusic]

Grumpy, on 29 November 2010 - 05:03 PM, said:

................... I agree re the computers. But isn't something similar available in the Queen's Hall?

The computers were taken out of the Queens Hall - a while back.  Plus the future of the Queens Hall is also uncertain.

[Grumpy]

weirdmusic, on 29 November 2010 - 05:50 PM, said:

The computers were taken out of the Queens Hall - a while back.  Plus the future of the Queens Hall is also uncertain.

I took the reference to the Queen's Hall computers from the village website, which still claims they are available.

However I'm sure you are right.

And if the future of the Queen's Hall is uncertain, isn't there an argument for considering the future of both buildings together?

[weirdmusic]

Grumpy, on 29 November 2010 - 07:26 PM, said:

...............And if the future of the Queen's Hall is uncertain, isn't there an argument for considering the future of both buildings together?

You would have thought so - but that would mean joined up thinking - councils aren't very good at that - 2 departments talking to each other - how likely is that?

[appropriatebridge]

weirdmusic, on 29 November 2010 - 05:50 PM, said:

The computers were taken out of the Queens Hall - a while back.  Plus the future of the Queens Hall is also uncertain.

Hang on, what is in doubt about the future of the Queens Hall? Burley has already had The Grange stolen from the people of Burley by Bradford MDC via one or other of the local authority reoganisations then sold. Surely we are not in danger of losing the Queens Hall as well. Can you give more details WM - have I missed something in the local press?

[weirdmusic]

appropriatebridge, on 30 November 2010 - 03:28 PM, said:

Hang on, what is in doubt about the future of the Queens Hall? Burley has already had The Grange stolen from the people of Burley by Bradford MDC via one or other of the local authority reoganisations then sold. Surely we are not in danger of losing the Queens Hall as well. Can you give more details WM - have I missed something in the local press?

Bradford Council charge a fixed rate for the hire of their "Public Halls" no matter where they are in the metropolitan area or in what condition (i.e. well kept or rundown).  

As far as I'm aware there is no discount for block booking or any incentive for people to hire the Queens Hall (or any hall under council control).  Consequently the Queens Hall remains closed for more hours of the week, than it is open.  But it still has to be maintained / heated etc - at what cost?

The point is being reached where it is not cost effective i.e. it is a drain on the council coffers.  You can draw your own conclusions as to what will happen to it next.

[Matt]

weirdmusic, on 29 November 2010 - 05:50 PM, said:

Plus the future of the Queens Hall is also uncertain.

I don't think it is. I did raise a discussion with the Parish Council recently as to whether it's long term sustainability lies with community ownership - I think it does and I'd like to see the village take it over if a way can be found to do that. However no-one has suggested the building is in any way at risk. Utilisation has improved since the refubishment and I understand it is one of Bradford's better performing community halls.

[appropriatebridge]

Matt, on 03 December 2010 - 11:03 PM, said:

I don't think it is. I did raise a discussion with the Parish Council recently as to whether it's long term sustainability lies with community ownership - I think it does and I'd like to see the village take it over if a way can be found to do that. However no-one has suggested the building is in any way at risk. Utilisation has improved since the refubishment and I understand it is one of Bradford's better performing community halls.

I think taking the Queens Hall over as a village asset would be a good idea - anything to stop Bradford one day selling it out from under us as they did with The Grange, although I have nothing but praise for the current owner! Broadly speaking, the less we have to do with Bradford the better - it is a progressively failing city on a downward spiral and I fear will eventually move towards disposing of anything it can to raise funds/save money to prop up the decaying city itself. Bradford obviously do not care a great deal about Burley (except as a cash generator) as evidenced by the fact that they have never actively tried to build us a bridge or as yet sort out The Stones! However, I strongly recommend that before any Is are dotted and Ts crossed a full professional condition survey of the Queens Hall is carried out to make sure that the village does not inherit any defects which financially it would struggle to rectify. Obvious things might be need for re-roof, re-wiring, subsidence, damp, rot - I could go on but you get the idea. This needs to be done by a professional building surveyor.

[weirdmusic]

Matt, on 03 December 2010 - 11:03 PM, said:

I don't think it is. I did raise a discussion with the Parish Council recently as to whether it's long term sustainability lies with community ownership - I think it does and I'd like to see the village take it over if a way can be found to do that. However no-one has suggested the building is in any way at risk. Utilisation has improved since the refubishment and I understand it is one of Bradford's better performing community halls.

How viable is it as a standalone entitity?  If the village take it over, isn't more likely to just become a millstone?
You may like the idea of it becoming a village asset, but the reality is somewhat different.

If the library is also up for grabs, would you want the village to take that on as well?

[Flas# #arry]

The Queens Hall will have been state of the art when it was built, but it does little to meet the requirements of the village now. The Library is a poor offering, but even the bigger one at Ilkley appears to be being run down. Call me old fashioned, but I like to see lots of books in a library, but now 'media' seems to be the mission statement; dvds, computers, cds.

Before taking on a white elephant, the community would do well to examine it's needs.

Sport: we have a good cricket club with tennis facilities, but a decent sports hall and changing facilities for the recreation ground is desirable, the land off Peel Place would be an ideal location for a gym/sports hall.

With the likes of Love film.com making a profit from renting DVDs by post, I just wonder if a central library distribution centre, mailing books free of charge to council tax payers might be more cost effective than keeping our ancient libraries going and providing library vans? Given that the other media is charged for, maybe the council could turn a profit?

The Queens Hall is neither beautiful nor useful, the Parish Council bit the bullet and built new parish rooms, now is the time for Burley to look at better council and community facilities. I suggest we try and break away from Bradford completely, we have nothing in common with the town and need nothing from them that we can't pay for privately with our council tax.

[appropriatebridge]

Flas# #arry, on 05 December 2010 - 01:40 PM, said:

...........I suggest we try and break away from Bradford completely, we have nothing in common with the town and need nothing from them that we can't pay for privately with our council tax.

As this is an interesting idea in its own right, I have started a separate thread to discuss it.

[Matt]

weirdmusic, on 04 December 2010 - 07:48 PM, said:

How viable is it as a standalone entitity?  If the village take it over, isn't more likely to just become a millstone?
You may like the idea of it becoming a village asset, but the reality is somewhat different.

If the library is also up for grabs, would you want the village to take that on as well?

You've hit the nail on the head with those questions - that's why it's a good idea to have the debate. You're right of course, that something being a good idea in principle doesn't make it easy to deliver or even workable in practice. We need to consider these things with great care over a good period of time. You'll note a similar debate has just started in Ilkley in the pages of the Gazette.

One option to look at might be some kind of Trust across wharfedale to hold and manage such assets for the community.

Matt

Flas# #arry, on 05 December 2010 - 01:40 PM, said:

The Queens Hall is neither beautiful nor useful

I do find it beautful - even inspriational actually! That may well be as much because of it's place in Burley's history as the design of the building itself - and also of course the two significance of the crosses outside.

Every day I battle with bureocrats on minor matters, buildings like that remind me how high our predecessors set the bar in terms of public service - and how much, over time, persistent centralisation had lowered it. It's pone of the reasons I beleive in making decisions, and delivering services, as locally as possible.

It's also a hugely useful building and without it we'd have huge problems in terms of many of the things that happen today in Burley.

[weirdmusic]

Matt, on 08 December 2010 - 09:05 PM, said:

It's also a hugely useful building and without it we'd have huge problems in terms of many of the things that happen today in Burley.

Do you know why Bradford Council charge a flat rate for the hire of their public halls?  
Why is it they don't show any flexibility in what they charge - i.e. give discounts for block booking or any incentives to get people to hire them?
Who sets the policy on this?

[mtricks]

Peel place would be an ideal place for a sports hall!!!??? the road is not suitable for the buildings that are there now...

there is a pefectly good sports hall in guiseley